Voting UKIP - why not?

[LA]

It was Margaret Thatcher I think, who said something along the lines that when the opposition reduce themselves to personal and gratuitous insult it shows that they have run out of serious argument.

I always cheer up immensely if an attack is particularly wounding because I think, well, if they attack one personally, it means they have not a single political argument left.

[Greg Lance-Watkins]

I always cheer up immensely if an attack is particularly wounding because I think, well, if they attack one personally, it means they have not a single political argument left.

Hi,

it is also most generous of them to provide an opportunity to respond, when they have so clearly shown they offer no more than an open goal!

Regards,
Greg L-W.

[octopus]

I always cheer up immensely if an attack is particularly wounding because I think, well, if they attack one personally, it means they have not a single political argument left.

Because in the main they have no agruement.

[octopus]

Yes, I am convinced that UKIP do have a chance, can they be any worse than Labour or Tory or any other party. From a straw pole that some of us took at work about three quarters of the staff said UKIP.



<LI class=profilefield_category>Signature

A politician needs the ability to foretell what is going to happen tomorrow, next week, next month, and next year. And to have the ability afterwards to explain why it didn't happen.

(Winston Churchill)

UKIP are the future of Britain. Why? They put our age old foes in the EU second, they put our burdens in the third world second, they put the rights of crimminals and yobs second, they put the rights of foreign crimminals second and fake ayslumn seekers second and certainly a war which is nothing to do with the UK - IS ALSO PUT SECOND. But they put the rights of BRITISH people FIRST. More money in the pockets of the low paid, no tax under £10,000; (just over £6,000 at the moment); and could you live on that income in 2009? let alone pay tax on it - Gordon Brown thinks so; not that he has any choice. All the thinks UKIP put SECOND, Gordon Brown puts FIRST; they are all very expensive past times.

[Midas]

UKIP are the future of Britain. Why? They put our age old foes in the EU second, they put our burdens in the third world second, they put the rights of crimminals and yobs second, they put the rights of foreign crimminals second and fake ayslumn seekers second and certainly a war which is nothing to do with the UK - IS ALSO PUT SECOND. But they put the rights of BRITISH people FIRST. More money in the pockets of the low paid, no tax under £10,000; (just over £6,000 at the moment); and could you live on that income in 2009? let alone pay tax on it - Gordon Brown thinks so; not that he has any choice. All the thinks UKIP put SECOND, Gordon Brown puts FIRST; they are all very expensive past times.

And you have an 'in principle' problem with putting our own citizens first?

[Greg Lance-Watkins]

And you have an 'in principle' problem with putting our own citizens first?

Hi,

that was brave of you

I couldn't quite fathom the comment he made but could it be he supports EUkip because everything they put second he does also and thus he supports the same things he believes they put first.

Octopus might be so good as to clarify!

Perhaps he could clarify what he believes EUkip put first.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

[Barry]

Unless something changes in the next few months I will not be voting either Ukip or Eukip.
I have decided that splitting the vote is too much of a risk, and that is the main reason.
I can't risk letting these incompetent 'people' back into government.

I am looking forward to them being the opposition again, at which time they will destroy themselves with the blame game after the election and infighting over the leadership. (Well, I can have some wishful thinking!)

[octopus]

And you have an 'in principle' problem with putting our own citizens first?

Our own citizens of the UK must always come first.

[octopus]

Hi,

that was brave of you

I couldn't quite fathom the comment he made but could it be he supports EUkip because everything they put second he does also and thus he supports the same things he believes they put first.

Octopus might be so good as to clarify!

Perhaps he could clarify what he believes EUkip put first.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

As a former member of UKIP I think you know what the policies are, and what I am saying.: Strong policies on law and order, immigration, help for our own low paid, no involvment in overseas wars, and pride in being British again - THAT"S WHY I SUPPORT UKIP AND ALWAYS PUT MY OWN COUNTRY FIRST. The things not only UKIP put first, but most British people put FIRST. The things we put second: ALL THE THINGS THAT ARE GOING ON NOW! The complete reverse of what most people want. As I said before Greg, Get out and talk to some of them; I do.

[Greg Lance-Watkins]

As a former member of UKIP I think you know what the policies are, and what I am saying.

Hi,

your answer to Midas clarified your statement - thanks.

Then you went on to obfuscate it again with this statement!

Are you saying you WERE a member of EUkip? I for one never was.

As for their policies you will of course be all too well aware they are puerile, un-costed, unsubstantiated and utterly irrelevant on two main counts:

01. they will never be in Governance to implement them.

02. policies put before Westminster are no longer decided by Westminster as of 01-Dec-2009 they must be fully approved by the British Government being the Governing body in Brussels.

If EUkip is seeking to persuade voters to support them based on their policies they are being utterly duplicitous as they, of all people, know (OR SHOULD) that their policies are utterly meaningless.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

[Greg Lance-Watkins]

As a former member of UKIP I think you know what the policies are, and what I am saying.: Strong policies on law and order, immigration, help for our own low paid, no involvment in overseas wars, and pride in being British again - THAT"S WHY I SUPPORT UKIP AND ALWAYS PUT MY OWN COUNTRY FIRST. The things not only UKIP put first, but most British people put FIRST. The things we put second: ALL THE THINGS THAT ARE GOING ON NOW! The complete reverse of what most people want. As I said before Greg, Get out and talk to some of them; I do.

Hi,

thanks for your more detailed response which cross posted!

As I have shown EUkip is being duplicitous if it pretends to policies.

In deed I put Britain first and the British peoples - would that EUkip had concentrated upon that and not got themselves so thoroughy suckered into the corruption in the EU.

Perhaps if EUkip had made more effort to inform, educate and debate they might have got the message across to the British peoples and they might have bothered addressing the New Constitution aka Lisbon Treaty before it was passed into law, whilst EUkip's leadership caroused and squabbled driving out honest activists and establishing a claque of shame!

When, like Caesar's wife, one is appointed to expose and clear the corruption of The Augian Stables it ill becomes one to serially be caught turning tricks behind the marble pillars of The Senate!

Regards,
Greg L-W.

[Greg Lance-Watkins]

Unless something changes in the next few months I will not be voting either Ukip or Eukip.
I have decided that splitting the vote is too much of a risk, and that is the main reason.
I can't risk letting these incompetent 'people' back into government.

I am looking forward to them being the opposition again, at which time they will destroy themselves with the blame game after the election and infighting over the leadership. (Well, I can have some wishful thinking!)

Hi,

an understandable position but in the light of the irrefutable fact that it couldn't matter less who is fiddling their allowances, expenses and salaries at Westminster since as of 01-Dec-2009 we are effectively directly ruled by Brussels - hence the massive battle between The Council of Ministers & The Commission behind closed doors as to which had the most power and woul place their own unelected president in place and their own Foreign Minister.

Interestingly the anti democratic placeman of the Commission is now President and will do all he can to centralise the power and the weakest link was used as the Foreign Minister as she is the most easily manipulated.

There is a relatively sound argument for returning a Labour Government in that The Tories might well paper over some of the cracks seeking importance and try to look as if they have a say whilst excercising their honey moon period.

Perhaps it needs to get a whole lot worse, which Labour would achieve, to waken the British peoples as to the atrocious betrayal by The LibLabCon, which now is the only route out ie by the people calling a plague on all their houses and something of a people's coup.

I shall act honourably and tell the truth in the ballot box as I refuse to spoil my ballot paper with a vote for a meaningless self serving politician whatever their footling party - I shall write on my ballot the only thing that matters to me and matters to Britain and its peoples:
LEAVE THE EU

Withdraw their mandate.

As the Chinese curse states 'May you live in interesting times'.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

[uncon]

Hi,


I shall act honourably and tell the truth in the ballot box as I refuse to spoil my ballot paper with a vote for a meaningless self serving politician whatever their footling party - I shall write on my ballot the only thing that matters to me and matters to Britain and its peoples:
LEAVE THE EU

.

I have to love you. I missed screaming Lord Such, and whereas you make slightly less sense and are a lot less entertaining, more self obsessed and a damn site less politically aware, you still make me laugh.

What I love about you is that you are like a fourteen year old screaming 'I can do what I like. I want to be emancipated like the American Kids' but yet you make no policy for paying back the loans given to us from Europe. You don't want to bite the hand that has kept us afloat right now - you want to sulk on it and paint your room black and then wonder why you don't have too many friends except when the big kids do something and then those new friends always drift back to them don't they? So you give it some more big talk that you can't deliver and less and less kids want to hear it.

I am tempted to say 'Suck it up Emo, your lies have caught up with you, but I am way too nice for that.

Was that too much? too true? I guess it could be deleted if enough complaints come in that a propspective politician can't handle the criticism, especially when it is delivered in a way that is understandable to most.

[Greg Lance-Watkins]

I have to love you. I missed screaming Lord Such, and whereas you make slightly less sense and are a lot less entertaining, more self obsessed and a damn site less politically aware, you still make me laugh.

What I love about you is that you are like a fourteen year old screaming 'I can do what I like. I want to be emancipated like the American Kids' but yet you make no policy for paying back the loans given to us from Europe. You don't want to bite the hand that has kept us afloat right now - you want to sulk on it and paint your room black and then wonder why you don't have too many friends except when the big kids do something and then those new friends always drift back to them don't they? So you give it some more big talk that you can't deliver and less and less kids want to hear it.

I am tempted to say 'Suck it up Emo, your lies have caught up with you, but I am way too nice for that.

Was that too much? too true? I guess it could be deleted if enough complaints come in that a propspective politician can't handle the criticism, especially when it is delivered in a way that is understandable to most.

Hi,

Do you have a point?

Your opinion lacks fact and misrepresents you as I am sure you are neither as insecure or self important as many of your postings.

That aside - what loans?

Is there any loan made by any Country on this planet to these United Kingdoms that could in any way justify surrendering our independence and sovereignty to being a vassal region of a corrupt centralised and largely communistic self serving Empirate at a cost of £45,000,000 per day!

Just a reminder for you - unlike most politicians David Such paid his own way!

Not a bad role model for many of our current parasites and scammers.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

[uncon]

Hi,

Do you have a point?

Your opinion lacks fact and misrepresents you as I am sure you are neither as insecure or self important as many of your postings.

That aside - what loans?

Is there any loan made by any Country on this planet to these United Kingdoms that could in any way justify surrendering our independence and sovereignty to being a vassal region of a corrupt centralised and largely communistic self serving Empirate at a cost of £45,000,000 per day!

Just a reminder for you - unlike most politicians David Such paid his own way!

Not a bad role model for many of our current parasites and scammers.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

I am every bit as self important as I come across, make no mistake.

Are you as congenitally stupid as you do? So you are going to dig deep into your pockets, pay off the debts that we owe and then wave bye bye?

In your mind do you awake in the morning to find your little woodland friends doing your housework, happily whistling while they work?

I only ask because in your attempts to actually address any issues, you prove yourself to be living in Cloud Cuckoo Land

[Greg Lance-Watkins]

I am every bit as self important as I come across, make no mistake.

Are you as congenitally stupid as you do? So you are going to dig deep into your pockets, pay off the debts that we owe and then wave bye bye?

In your mind do you awake in the morning to find your little woodland friends doing your housework, happily whistling while they work?

I only ask because in your attempts to actually address any issues, you prove yourself to be living in Cloud Cuckoo Land

Hi,

so I was right - you don't have any facts to back your trite trolling.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

[uncon]

Hi,

so I was right - you don't have any facts to back your trite trolling.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

Hi

You have avoided every point made to you with long reams of absolutely...nothing.

I have read these reams and people usually get compensated when they have boredom as mind control used.

You have nothing to say, and yet you say it ....well, not with passion, but with dedication. You are unable to connect with anyone or answer anything they have to say because you may deviate from a script that ...again...says nothing.

I'm fascinated! Scientologists seem to have more freewill. They want me to believe in Aliens and even that is more than you have given me to support!

Here is your opportunity to shine...3 questions:

How would you solve the economic crisis?

how would you ensure that our economy will grow?

How will you ensure employment?

[Greg Lance-Watkins]

Hi

You have avoided every point made to you with long reams of absolutely...nothing.

I have read these reams and people usually get compensated when they have boredom as mind control used.

You have nothing to say, and yet you say it ....well, not with passion, but with dedication. You are unable to connect with anyone or answer anything they have to say because you may deviate from a script that ...again...says nothing.

I'm fascinated! Scientologists seem to have more freewill. They want me to believe in Aliens and even that is more than you have given me to support!

Here is your opportunity to shine...3 questions:

How would you solve the economic crisis?

how would you ensure that our economy will grow?

How will you ensure employment?

Hi,

you make my point for me - much to criticise, nothing to give and all so you can look clever in your insecurity.

Cheerio. You are a time waster on an ego trip - sorry I don't do councilling, you'll have to take your insecurity elsewhere.

May I remind you this is a Political Thread titled:
Voting UKIP - why not?

See if you can contribute.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

[Major Sinic]

Hi,

you make my point for me - much to criticise, nothing to give and all so you can look clever in your insecurity.

Cheerio. You are a time waster on an ego trip - sorry I don't do councilling, you'll have to take your insecurity elsewhere.

May I remind you this is a Political Thread titled:
Voting UKIP - why not?

See if you can contribute.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

Hi,

I am not really interested in the personal friction between you and uncon.

Nor do your long, and often repetitive postings, with occasional fanciful interpretations of the facts, fully persuade me of the merits of your case.

I have no doubt that the facts which you produce are accurate, although perhaps selective. I also have little doubt that you are sincere, even passionate in your views. However uncon does ask three very relevant questions, which are at the very hub of the issue. I for one would be genuinely interested in reading your answers.

regards

Major Sinic

[Greg Lance-Watkins]

Hi,

I am not really interested in the personal friction between you and uncon.

Nor do your long, and often repetitive postings, with occasional fanciful interpretations of the facts, fully persuade me of the merits of your case.

I have no doubt that the facts which you produce are accurate, although perhaps selective. I also have little doubt that you are sincere, even passionate in your views. However uncon does ask three very relevant questions, which are at the very hub of the issue. I for one would be genuinely interested in reading your answers.

regards

Major Sinic

Hi,

since Britain has absolutely no control over the making of its laws and since we are bound by The EU.

Step one to solving any of these 3 questions is leave the EU.

Since the topic of this thread is:
Voting UKIP - why not?

Is there a sound reason for childish point scoring? Perhaps if you wish to discuss methods of resolving the three questions it might be apposite to ask the three as separate threads. IF you are serious just lead the question in the apposite are of the Forum and I will be only too happy to try to constructively respond (I would appreciate a heads up to where and when you do so).

I hope this helps.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

[Major Sinic]

Hi,

since Britain has absolutely no control over the making of its laws and since we are bound by The EU.

Step one to solving any of these 3 questions is leave the EU.

Since the topic of this thread is:
Voting UKIP - why not?

Is there a sound reason for childish point scoring? Perhaps if you wish to discuss methods of resolving the three questions it might be apposite to ask the three as separate threads. IF you are serious just lead the question in the apposite are of the Forum and I will be only too happy to try to constructively respond (I would appreciate a heads up to where and when you do so).

I hope this helps.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

Hi,

I think it was fairly obvious that I was serious in my query. I fail to understand your reference to childish point scoring.

I note however that you have pointedly failed to answer the three questions, with a less than adroit side step.

I am genuinely disappointed. You publish and repeat what you want others to hear ad nauseam, yet when someone (uncon) asks you specific and very relevant questions which, if you had expected to retain any degree of credibility, you would have been only too happy to try and answer you duck out.

Verbal diarrhoea and empty vessels spring to mind.

regards

Major Sinic

[Greg Lance-Watkins]

Hi, I think it was fairly obvious that I was serious in my query.

& had you bothered reading what I actually said rather than whatever you read into it - I did you the courtesy of a serious response.

I fail to understand your reference to childish point scoring.

Clearly you did or you would have realised I was commenting on the childish and offensive posts made earlier NOT yours.

I note however that you have pointedly failed to answer the three questions, with a less than adroit side step.

That is clearly untrue. I have tried to leave this thread on topic and asked you to ask your perfectly valid questions in the right place as new threads and as a courtesy give me a heads up as to where you have located them and I will respond. No side step from me despite your offensive comments.

I am genuinely disappointed.

Then re-read my entry and you will be much cheered as long as you don't misread it again.

You publish and repeat what you want others to hear ad nauseam,

Yep and I'm happy to discuss it - that is largely how Forums work!

yet when someone (uncon) asks you specific and very relevant questions which, if you had expected to retain any degree of credibility, you would have been only too happy to try and answer you duck out.

Credibility!!!

Verbal diarrhoea and empty vessels spring to mind. regards Major Sinic

Then don't read it - reassume a crano rectally retentive position and continue to be negative and gratuitously offensive.

Your Choice - read the comments and respond in a civilised and grown up manner or continue needlessly and gratuitously to be an offensive prat.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

[Barry]

Perhaps if you wish to discuss methods of resolving the three questions it might be apposite to ask the three as separate threads. IF you are serious just lead the question in the apposite are of the Forum and I will be only too happy to try to constructively respond (I would appreciate a heads up to where and when you do so).

I hope this helps.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

As I am the OP, I am perfectly happy for the 3 questions on policy to be answered in this thread.
As long as our dear mods are, too.
The thread has about run it's course.

[Major Sinic]

Your Choice - read the comments and respond in a civilised and grown up manner or continue needlessly and gratuitously to be an offensive prat.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

Hi,

Pot, kettle and black spring to mind.

regards

Major Sinic

[Midas]

Can we please get back on topic here or the thread will be closed.

[Greg Lance-Watkins]

Hi,

Pot, kettle and black spring to mind.

regards

Major Sinic

Hi,

have you set up the three separate questions yet? or were you just weenie waggling?

BACK TO TOPIC:

If you haven't seen it yet there is an excellent Video of Nigel Farage floating around where he challenges Rumpy Dumpy the new EU President and Baroness Ashcan the new Foreigner Minister.

If only Farage had stuck to what he is good at instead of dragging EUkip into the gutter with his idiotic behaviour.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

[Barry]

Hi,
If you haven't seen it yet there is an excellent Video of Nigel Farage floating around where he challenges Rumpy Dumpy the new EU President and Baroness Ashcan the new Foreigner Minister.

A link would be nice, Lance. (YouTube?)

[Greg Lance-Watkins]

A link would be nice, Lance. (YouTube?)

Hi,

sorry I seem to get it wrong every time I try to put a link in, and as no one knows when threads will be locked by style gurus it is a tad off putting to try to waste the time working links!

Do try this with luck it will work:

Nigel Farage &The Speech The European Parliament did not want to hear Video

Regards,
Greg L-W.

[Barry]

Thanks for posting that video Lance.
What I found astounding, watching that, was that the chairman asked Farage to tone down, but in fact it was not his manner, but his opinion and words which were objectionable.
I wonder how long it will be before it will be forbidden to speak against the great unholy state of Europe.
Uncomfortable watching, isn't it?

[Greg Lance-Watkins]

Thanks for posting that video Lance.
What I found astounding, watching that, was that the chairman asked Farage to tone down, but in fact it was not his manner, but his opinion and words which were objectionable.
I wonder how long it will be before it will be forbidden to speak against the great unholy state of Europe.
Uncomfortable watching, isn't it?

Hi,

it is written into The New Constitution of The EU aka The Lisbon Constitution.

Regards,
Greg L-W.

[octopus]

Thanks for posting that video Lance.
What I found astounding, watching that, was that the chairman asked Farage to tone down, but in fact it was not his manner, but his opinion and words which were objectionable.
I wonder how long it will be before it will be forbidden to speak against the great unholy state of Europe.
Uncomfortable watching, isn't it?

Not very long, I wouldn"t think.

[Greg Lance-Watkins]

Not very long, I wouldn"t think.

Hi,

I so envy you the optimism!

Clearly you have not read the New Constitution - just start by reading Article 50:

1. Any Member State may decide to withdraw from the Union in accordance with its own constitutional requirements.

2. A Member State which decides to withdraw shall notify the European Council of its intention.
In the light of the guidelines provided by the European Council, the Union shall negotiate and conclude an agreement with that State, setting out the arrangements for its withdrawal, taking account of the
framework for its future relationship with the Union. That agreement shall be negotiated in accordance with Article 218(3) of the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union. It shall be concluded on
behalf of the Union by the Council, acting by a qualified majority, after obtaining the consent of the European Parliament.
9.5.2008 EN Official Journal of the European Union C 115/43

3. The Treaties shall cease to apply to the State in question from the date of entry into force of the withdrawal agreement or, failing that, two years after the notification referred to in paragraph 2, unless the European Council, in agreement with the Member State concerned, unanimously decides to extend this period.

4. For the purposes of paragraphs 2 and 3, the member of the European Council or of the Council representing the withdrawing Member State shall not participate in the discussions of the European Council or Council or in decisions concerning it.
A qualified majority shall be defined in accordance with Article 238(3)(b) of the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union.

5. If a State which has withdrawn from the Union asks to rejoin, its request shall be subject to the procedure referred to in Article 49.


Read Article 50 Section 4!

Don't hold your breath or to expect to survive the process!

The ONLY way out now is either its collapse or take the battle to the streets as we would have done if conquered in 1942!

THE SAME ENEMY just different strategy!

Read EUroPaische Witschaft Gemeinschaft - English translation available at:
CLICK HERE

Then perhaps Harry Beckhough's book 'Germany's Four Reichs' also on the web at:
CLICK HERE Then follow the links.

Regards,
Greg L-W.